And what makes it POSSIBLE to have a "looker" (as opposed to "singer") like Spears sell more records?

Um, that would be Pro Tools, Autotoune, Melodyne, etc., etc.

Without these little helpers, Britney Spears is nothing but a visual - with no sound that anyone wants to hear.




Or, perhaps it means there will just be more mediocre, talentless hacks that have an outlet for their crap.

I'm betting on the latter. Indeed, it's not even a bet. The state of the industry is already proven this to be what is happening.



Don't bet on it. These are VERY different times.

Just for starters: The Beatles didn't have to compete with 1,000 times more competitive acts, cell phones, video games, DVDs, On Demand, multiplex theaters, etc., etc., etc. for the teenagers' attention, in their day.

The days of the universal, music mega-star are long behind us.

And they are not coming back.

Yeah the fuacking mbox. A lot of my clients are buying it and now doing there own production. Some actually have the nerve to call me and ask for help with it.

They figure "well I got PT, I can do it myself now". PT is just software. Any DAW can work as well. They don't have a clue really about WC, pre amps ect ect.

Or how to WRITE or PERFORM a SONG!!!

I get that a lot too Jeremy. I like to help people out and get them going but don't like to work for free any more. The good thing is. They still can't mix for the most part. An the only way Ill teach them is if they want me to mix their album - they can watch and learn for $$.

J

and more and more of these kiddy brats think that they can just walk out with PT on a live gig and plug it in and make their band sound 'just like the record'. Then they complain when it doesn't sound like it did in the studio .. it must be the system's fault. The level of professionalism in the field is dropping as more and more of these weekend basement hacks come on the scene ... and all this 'fix my lack of talent' plugs are what's driving it.

If they would get out on a stage with no pitch correctors/effects, etc. and just sing ... THEN they deserve to be there and record an album.

The most amazing performer I have run into yet was Jewel. She showed up before her last album was released ... our show was here SIXTH performance THAT DAY (3 radio stations and 2 in-stores before she got to us). We gave her a countryman DI, a stock SM58 (no beta) out of our workbox, and a Shure in-ear beltpack. The only FX I eventually put on her was a small plate verb. A bit of EQ on the guitar, a shading on the vocal, and that's it. Not even compression on either input. All the crowd reaction and noise is being picked up from her vocal mic.
This is what I expect a real artist can do. This was in a swank restaurant (fundraiser) downtown on a portable 8x8 stage.

I put a clip of this performance on my site, you can listen, but please don't distribute it !!!!! Media Clip

Wow Joe that Jewel clip sounds really good.



Oh no, The Beatles had no obstacles at all. Not like bible-thumping parents who were outraged at the long hair and wild beats and lyrics. If any group proved music could change the world it was The Beatles. Now go program your cell phone and play some video games

yeah ... that's live - right from the line out's on the console (Yamaha DM2000v2) - They took my feed and went straight to air on the local Cities 97 FM station.

That's what a really talented artist sounds like without any tricks. I have to believe that the same amount of 'effort' is needed in the studio to record her albums ... throw up a mic, and record it ... done. No spending countless hours tuning, cuting and pasting from 50 takes hoping to have enough for one 'seamless' track, etc. All the credit for that clip goes to her .... I didn't spend the whole set trying to polish a turd .. I sat back and enjoyed the set and the remarkable presence she had.

This whole discussion is a mute point unless you are an "A"list producer engineer or you don't need to get paid for a living.

Joe, the percentage of performers that are of that quality are very low. The chances to have someone to come in like that are rare - and yes I have had that quality as well - They come in and nail it. So now for the other 360 days of the year and having paying clients come though the door over and over that do not have an unlimited budget so they can't comp vocals all week on one song. Can they sing? Yes.. Are they Jewel? No... Do they have heart? Yes.
My hat is off to Justin for putting his song up. Does he sing like Jewel? I hope not. But he has a pretty good song. The Melody stayed with me.

You can all all bark all you want about the quality of the artist and the tools that are used to fix them. Its all BS.

But come on, get real. What pays the bills? It is pie in the sky to have attitude when are in this business. It is our job to make them sound great.
If someone wants to pay be $60 an hour to FIX their vocal, time their drums, fix the bass - That is fine with me.

:P at least it's not a time aligned and pitch corrected moot point.

Sure it is. It seems like there is something spiritual that is apart or music when 2,3,4 or more people play and make "music". I do not think you can really replicate that with a machine. Sure it can keep a 2/4 beat, but it is not the interactions of a group. You can tell that when a bass player is playing off a drummer. Or when a guitar player really knows how to play in the holes instead of chopping wood the whole time.
The last part of this whole discussion stems from weather it is ok to "FIX" that when its not so good. And how far do you fix it. I agree with you as to it relates to the goal you are trying to achieve.


J